New Non-BOSS Pedals

[fuzzbuzzfuzz]

NPD: Subdecay Spring Theory Reverberator

Quite the rabbit hole (ongoing for an age!) but I can't resist trying the odd reverb pedal every now and then when they pop up.

On my board is usually a stalwart RV-2 which I like very much, usually I'm simply looking for a mild plate or spring "classic" sounding amp like reverb that doesnt wash out so much with drive. That said I'm also a  fan of a nice "Spring" and that is a much tougher nut to crack pedal wise. (For reference I enjoy using the old Shin Ei ER-23 Echo/VErb units, which have a great preamp and an authentic spring, alas they are quite short and bongy not a lush deep sound.

So I picked up a used Subdecay Spring Theory a few days ago, as the price was OK (ish!) and I couldn't resist that "Fender Blackface" look (matching the BBE Tremolo too). I tend to keep my expectations low with digital verbs. 

PROS
- Easy-ish to dial in after getting used to balancing the controls.
- Smallish footprint, 9v-18v operation
- 18v sounded clearer perhaps so that's what I stuck too.
- Balanced tone, not too digital, not too bright, sits nicely in the mix.
- Two modes, Spring and Room are quite noticeably different (mostly decay/trail length). The Room mode is very similar to the RV-2- Infinite delay overdub wash on max settings Room setting. 

CONS- Not much "drip", probably better at mimicking a "standard" Fender amp reverb rather than Dick Dale!
- Not much adjustment with the length of the reverberation, it's relatively short "spring" length, I'd like longer..
- Gets very wet/ambient quite quick, subtle settings are a bit tricky as the verb seems to tighten up/get short.

> More versatile than the Holy Grail Neo (way to wet) and Nano, depth control is a must!
> Smaller than the Tech 21 RVB, Spring setting inc. less artificial(?)
> Less "fake/cloying" than my Malekko Spring but I'd need to A/B a bit more.

In short I kept my expectations low and I can see a use for it, either as an addition to the RV-2 for a second deeper verb setting or for a mini board when jamming with verbless amps. It's fairly natural sounding. WIth both the EHX's I was pretty much reboxing them for sale on the same day! 

Overall 7.5/10

Still love my RV-2, as it has a great deal of tweak control (like the EQ pre delay) and when hit with drive it doesn't wash out. I'm also still tempted to mod an RV-2 for a second footswitch to just nudge up the depth control as I'm often bending down to adjust depending on the song.

Final thought is a general gripe - there are so many wonderful verbs out there (Surfy Bear I'm looking at you!) but it bugs me that I'd be paying as much as guitar or amp for one! At 38,500yen for the SB spring, I could buy a 2nd Blues Jr or install a new reverb tank. 

Actually I have a rather large SIB Varidrive also in Blackface garb which would be a cool pedalboard to put together if I wished!

Who else has gone down the very deep reverberation rabbit hole?

[laurie]

NPD: Subdecay Spring Theory Reverberator


Who else has gone down the very deep reverberation rabbit hole?

Nice overview! Thanks!

I am trying to go down the hole. I started with the cheap-and-(it turns out)-nasty Rev Tank: http://www.bossareaforum.com/Forum/view ... f=13&t=719

And am looking for something better. Preferably the next attempt is a Boss RV-x. I refuse to pay new prices for pedals I may or may not use long term, and there have been none (zero) available around town since I've been looking.

I have an Alesis Microverb in deep storage at the relative's place in Australia and I'm thinking of having that mailed over. It is rack-mount, but can be controlled with a footswitch.

[Pepe]

The next saved pedal: ProCo Deucetone RAT.

The unreliable footswitches were replaced with good quality switches by Alpha. I also replaced both OP070 opamps with the legendary LM308.

The design of the Deucetone RAT is not too service-friendly. To get access to the circuit boards the rivets of the mode selector switches had to be drilled off. I used black screws with hexagonal nuts to retain a similar look. Last night I spent three hours with the desoldering and replacement of the ICs and footswitches and with the fiddly reassembling of the pedal.

But it was totally worth it! The new footswitches work perfectly and the pedal sounds awesome. To my ears it sounds a bit better with the LM308 and personally I think that the tone is more lively this way.

[laurie]

Very nice work pepe!! Those cap-screws holding the switches look completely original, and better than the rivets would have looked.

That looks like a really good pedal.

[Pepe]

It is! The only really dumb thing is that there is almost no space for the 9V battery, no matter how I try to put it in. And when it fits, it touches the wires of the footswitches and that results in crackling noise. I just ordered a power supply adaptor for the 1/8'' jack.

[fuzzbuzzfuzz]

NPD: Subdecay Spring Theory Reverberator


Who else has gone down the very deep reverberation rabbit hole?

Nice overview! Thanks!

I am trying to go down the hole. I started with the cheap-and-(it turns out)-nasty Rev Tank: http://www.bossareaforum.com/Forum/view ... f=13&t=719

And am looking for something better. Preferably the next attempt is a Boss RV-x. I refuse to pay new prices for pedals I may or may not use long term, and there have been none (zero) available around town since I've been looking.

I have an Alesis Microverb in deep storage at the relative's place in Australia and I'm thinking of having that mailed over. It is rack-mount, but can be controlled with a footswitch.

Ah yes the Rev Tank, interesting box. 

The name and style is not dissimilar to the JHS Spring Tank, which I now recall having a while back. Not a bad box in terms of having two independent footswitchable reverbs in a small space but quite pricey I suppose  for most and I wouldn't say it was so "lush", or "drippy".  Perhaps "modern" and "tight".

Again more like a Holy Grail x2. 

Quite a battle to get a "cheap" reverb for the money that sounds acceptable to the ears!

I've pondered a few others over the years, and often the "put-off" of most modern reverb pedals - an obvious delay mimicking a reverb - can easily be done with...well an existing delay pedal!  With the Spring tank it was replacing two long-chip DD-3s for space.

Prior to that I was happy with either the Guyatone Delay Box, set short, or the Big Jam Reverb/Delay, both set for a mild "verb". Being analog I didn't get that "fake" or "weirdly modulated" tone destroying my clean signal or drive, and felt more comfortable having them on the board.
Digital reverbs often feel "stiff" and the dynamics of the dry signal vanish as the mix is cranked.

Also Tried:

• Holy Grail (Original) - one good trick,still got a mint crated one, needs a specific 500ma adaptor.
  Holy Grail Nano - same as above
  Holy Grail Neo - far too wet too quickly one trick, good but expensive really for the lack of tweeking.
  Holy Grail Plus - it was expensive at the time, mix control useful, I may buy again if cheap.
  Dr.Scientist ????? - lots of options but that same "hard" sound, "plate" reverb I guess.
  RV-2 - still my favourite easy use reverb
  RV-3 - modern, bit plasticky, sold.
  Catlinbread Topanga - a famous one, expensive, tried briefly in store, needed more time I think.
  Shin Ei ER-23 - great boing, great preamp, very short spring though, may mod one (heresy!)
  Danelectro BLT - bit cheap and cheerful, terrible bypass, the PJ+B did a better job I think but not shcoking.
  Malekko Chicklet - loved it when it came out, quite a thick sound but a bit overwhelming sometimes, not fake just cloying. There(s a cheap clone on Amazon. Good overall though
  Danelectro Spring King - Surprisingly good overall, but a short spring. May tinker modding if time.

Would like to try/buy:

• Guyatone MR-2 (rare)
  EHX Holiest Grail (big box all black - drool!) 
  Tech 21 IVB Boost v2 (dry through, simple controls, might be better than the prior issue)
  DOD FX-45 (super short but I'm a sucker for analog boxes, very rare)
  Malekko Spring Chicken - wonder if better than the Chicklet.
  TC Mini HOF - I'm a luddite and love analog simplicity but I feel this may actually be the logical way for anyone given the footprint and edit capabilities.
  TC Spring 
  Fender Tre-Verb (fancy, pricy)
  Surfy Bear (probably "the one", but pricy!)
  Van Amps Sole Mate (real spring, pricy)
  Guyatone FV-2000 - a huge amp head like beast.
  Carl Martin Spring Reverb - Oh I'd lvoe this and regret missing one, two verbs, real spring)

I tend to gravitate to older, rarer more awkward quirky things, not a crowd follower despite that probably being the best option sometimes haha.

Ideally a Reverb pedal to me should*

> Emulate older classic verbs well.
> No obvious "delay" echos
> Allow clean dry through
> No "fake" or "modulated"-ness
> Have a mix control! and possibly a boost
> Have a nice preamp perhaps
> Sit in the mix
> Look nice!!

NB: The Alesis had a good reputation back in the day iirc. Be intersting to here about it.

For compact Springy verb I dig the Malekko (or possibly its clone?), and I am enjoying the Subdecay now mounted on my main board as 2nd verb. Sits very well in the mix, natural sounding, two knobs can be toe-ed! Not very springy though.

NB2: Ever thought of building a reverb Laurie? (or a preamp box like the Anasounds that does the control and then you use your tank to connect too)
I'd buy that!

[fuzzbuzzfuzz]

The next saved pedal: ProCo Deucetone RAT.

The unreliable footswitches were replaced with good quality switches by Alpha. I also replaced both OP070 opamps with the legendary LM308.

The design of the Deucetone RAT is not too service-friendly. To get access to the circuit boards the rivets of the mode selector switches had to be drilled off. I used black screws with hexagonal nuts to retain a similar look. Last night I spent three hours with the desoldering and replacement of the ICs and footswitches and with the fiddly reassembling of the pedal.

But it was totally worth it! The new footswitches work perfectly and the pedal sounds awesome. To my ears it sounds a bit better with the LM308 and personally I think that the tone is more lively this way.

Looks good Pepe!

But why did they put the switches soooo close together? All that space!

[Pepe]

Thanks! The answer is very simple: with shoes you can stomp them both at once to switch between Channel A and B.

[laurie]

Quite a battle to get a "cheap" reverb for the money that sounds acceptable to the ears!

I've pondered a few others over the years, and often the "put-off" of most modern reverb pedals - an obvious delay mimicking a reverb - can easily be done with...well an existing delay pedal!  With the Spring tank it was replacing two long-chip DD-3s for space.

Prior to that I was happy with either the Guyatone Delay Box, set short, or the Big Jam Reverb/Delay, both set for a mild "verb". Being analog I didn't get that "fake" or "weirdly modulated" tone destroying my clean signal or drive, and felt more comfortable having them on the board.
Digital reverbs often feel "stiff" and the dynamics of the dry signal vanish as the mix is cranked.

Also Tried:

• Holy Grail (Original) - one good trick,still got a mint crated one, needs a specific 500ma adaptor.
  Holy Grail Nano - same as above
  Holy Grail Neo - far too wet too quickly one trick, good but expensive really for the lack of tweeking.
  Holy Grail Plus - it was expensive at the time, mix control useful, I may buy again if cheap.
  Dr.Scientist ????? - lots of options but that same "hard" sound, "plate" reverb I guess.
  RV-2 - still my favourite easy use reverb
  RV-3 - modern, bit plasticky, sold.
  Catlinbread Topanga - a famous one, expensive, tried briefly in store, needed more time I think.
  Shin Ei ER-23 - great boing, great preamp, very short spring though, may mod one (heresy!)
  Danelectro BLT - bit cheap and cheerful, terrible bypass, the PJ+B did a better job I think but not shcoking.
  Malekko Chicklet - loved it when it came out, quite a thick sound but a bit overwhelming sometimes, not fake just cloying. There(s a cheap clone on Amazon. Good overall though
  Danelectro Spring King - Surprisingly good overall, but a short spring. May tinker modding if time.

Would like to try/buy:

• Guyatone MR-2 (rare)
  EHX Holiest Grail (big box all black - drool!) 
  Tech 21 IVB Boost v2 (dry through, simple controls, might be better than the prior issue)
  DOD FX-45 (super short but I'm a sucker for analog boxes, very rare)
  Malekko Spring Chicken - wonder if better than the Chicklet.
  TC Mini HOF - I'm a luddite and love analog simplicity but I feel this may actually be the logical way for anyone given the footprint and edit capabilities.
  TC Spring 
  Fender Tre-Verb (fancy, pricy)
  Surfy Bear (probably "the one", but pricy!)
  Van Amps Sole Mate (real spring, pricy)
  Guyatone FV-2000 - a huge amp head like beast.
  Carl Martin Spring Reverb - Oh I'd lvoe this and regret missing one, two verbs, real spring)

I tend to gravitate to older, rarer more awkward quirky things, not a crowd follower despite that probably being the best option sometimes haha.

Ideally a Reverb pedal to me should*

> Emulate older classic verbs well.
> No obvious "delay" echos
> Allow clean dry through
> No "fake" or "modulated"-ness
> Have a mix control! and possibly a boost
> Have a nice preamp perhaps
> Sit in the mix
> Look nice!!

This is gold. Thanks!

NB2: Ever thought of building a reverb Laurie? (or a preamp box like the Anasounds that does the control and then you use your tank to connect too)
I'd buy that!

Strangely, yes. I think about building one, then decide it would have to be tube powered like the original Fender Reverb and it gets too big and complicated

[laurie]

Thanks! The answer is very simple: with shoes you can stomp them both at once to switch between Channel A and B.

Makes sense - if only one of them is active stomping both switches between them. Actually quite clever.